Suzanne: Counseling, Friendship and Loss
Suzanne Jost is a 78-year-old Jewish woman who was born in New York City. She’s had many, many adventures in between but moved to Peoria, IL when her husband took a job at Bradley University. Suzanne is a retired Christian Counselor formerly with the Antioch Group. She gave her life to Jesus in the 1970s in California during the Jesus Movement. She is one of my favorite people. I first met her when I was young. Neither of us can remember the beginning.
I’ve been to Suzanne’s house too many times to count. It’s a favorite place for me. It’s almost as familiar to me as my own family’s house. Suzanne and John Jost are not family though. They are the friends we choose to call our family. My two year old affectionately calls them (in the Haitian tradition as per their request), Uncle and Aunt. For me titles are significant, but some people transcend titles. Some people integrate themselves into your life in such a way that to say their names alone is full of meaning enough; there’s just so much significant history there.
It was about 10:00AM on a Wednesday morning when I sat down with Suzanne: the sweet spot after breakfast and before lunch and nap time (Good-grief. I’m such a mom now). We sat outside on Suzanne’s porch because it was a perfect fall day and, you know, COVID. My daughter interrupted most of our conversation but it didn’t matter. I came to interview Suzanne about relationships (specifically her friendship with my mom before she passed away in 2017), but truth be told I was really just making an excuse to spend time with her and talk with her. Even after knowing someone pretty much your whole life you realize how much there still is to know about them. This is a snap shot of our time together.
Sarah: How do you define a friend?
Suzanne: Someone whose presence you enjoy. And has a mutual sense of wanting to share time together. Of course, honesty and being able to be open with one another. Being able to be who you really are with this person. There’s no need to pretend.
Sarah: How did you meet my mom?
Suzanne: It’s been so long I had to ask John (her husband), to help me remember. We think it has to have been initially through John when your mom was singing in Community Chorus. Your mom was such a deeply social person. You know, she’s just friends with everyone.
The moment Suzanne said that a flash flood of memories from my youth came to mind. Once I had a car, anytime I would go to the grocery store, the theatre, or coffee shop I’d run into one of my mom’s friends or her students. They’d say, “OH! You’re Shirley’s daughter, right?” Begrudgingly I’d say “Oh, yeah.” because I was greeted this way so often. It really did feel like everyone knew my mom. Not living in my hometown anymore as an adult makes me miss these kinds of interactions. Makes me miss a town that knew her. Makes me miss her.
Suzanne and I share a smile.
Suzanne: As we got to know your mom and dad they invited us to their church and the rest is history.
Sarah: What makes people decide to get to know someone else?
Suzanne: Well, of course I think of your mom. Your mom made herself accessible and that was attractive and inviting. And I’d say, time. Over time it will be revealed to both parties if the other person is someone you decided you want to continue in relationship with. Lovers look face to face. Friendships stand side by side. So you ask yourself is this person someone I want to keep standing side by side with?
Sarah: Why do you think God created us to be in relationship with others?
Suzanne: From the beginning, we could not exist without relationship. Think about a mother and a child, think about the family connection. It’s all God’s design. So, I think there are simple biological reasons: we need community to survive. As humans we have the gift of language and we need to communicate with others. The process of discovering who you are and who I am and our points of view, this happens in community. The mystery of being conscious beings, we figure all that out in community with people who are similar and different than us.
There’s also this idea of relationship between a mother and an infant; birth, nurturing, protecting; it’s all very intimate. And we are born into a one-on-one relationship, which establishes a norm and a need for close relationship.
Sarah: In your career as a Christian Counselor with the Antioch Group, what seems to be the biggest stumbling block for close intimate relationships?
Suzanne: I guess fear that once we have exposed who we are that we won’t be accepted. Or fear that when you have presented your needs or expectations that then you will be rejected and ultimately be alone. There’s a deep fear of…Not being accepted by others…Of being physically alone…Not being able to share the essence of who we are with others…Of being judged by others. Not being judged, that’s why, at least in part, you see a counselor. It has the potential to be a safe place/person to be who you are without the fear of being judged.
Sarah: From all the relationships you’ve counseled and observed over the years why and how do you stay friends?
Suzanne: Proximity. For example: Once your mom started working with John and we had this common ground of work community, and church community and over 30 years, friendship was established. So, proximity and time.
Sarah: I think you’re right. But it’s something to be grieved in the season I’m in. Now that I’m married and we are established in our town, home, family, and church, reality is sinking in about many of my friends who have moved away over the last few years. Those friendships mean so much to me, but they will change over time. They already have. I just hate change. My friend Chelsea even told me, “Yeah I think you’re gonna have a hard time when you get married and start having babies, Sarah. Socializing and friendships just look very different on the other side.”
Suzanne: This is also, very normal.
Sarah: Right, right. Heaven, the reunion of the saints….
OK…
Something that is fascinating to me is how opposites attract. Not always of course, but some of my closest friends I would say are very…very different than me. It’s why they drive me crazy, but our differences are also the reason I love them so. Can you paint me a picture of your relationship with my mom since, at least from the outside looking in, people would describe you both as having very different personalities, backgrounds and life experiences etc.?
Suzanne: We are very different people, your mom and I. I observe that people are drawn in by the differences in others OR it just doesn’t matter. For your mom and I, it was always easy to be honest with each other. That’s a gift. To be honest with yourself and honest with others is very vulnerable. If you had to write it out…
I would say that I am a…
Questioner
Challenger
Opposer
Shirley was a…
Acceptor
Believer (as in she believed easily, even naturally)
Supportive
But it was never a competition with your mom. She saw herself as a supporter, a cheerleader among other things. When when your mom and I met first met, I had a lot of questions about faith, church, marriage dynamics, etc. Friendship is not easy especially with someone like me, who questions so much. But she listened to me. We had great discussions.
Suzanne wanted to note that that foot pot was a gift, she would never buy something that ugly. I literally laughed out loud when she said that. My mom probably bought it for her!
Suzanne: Your mom was not shy about talking about hard stuff. I liked that. She just went for it. And as you conversed with her you had a sense that you were accepted for who you were. There was nothing superficial or artificial about her. Over time I think we were just woven together. For us it wasn’t just church stuff, but through real spiritual matters and matters of the heart that we were both able to mutually help each other grow.
Sarah: Why do you think you became friends with my mom?
She paused
Suzanne: Being who you are with someone else is the essence of what it means to have intimacy with God. Real transparency, truthfulness and freedom, this is what God wants to have with us. Your mom and I had this kind of relationship. We were both free to be ourselves - we were able to share in the essence of who we were with each other. And I found in Shirley a validation for the way I see my relationship with God.
Sarah: So, the obvious question is, how are you dealing with the grief that comes from losing a close friend?
She laughs
Suzanne: A lot of denial. It’s overwhelming at times. I think when it comes to grief because of the nature of it, you have to break it down. Or it will break you down. You have to say, I’m gonna have it out. I’m going to have my cry right now and then say, OK, we will revisit this tomorrow. It’s necessary at times to have a break. Otherwise you could drown. How do you do it?
Sarah: I’m trying to figure that out…All I know is it’s a slow process for me. My dad (a now widower) and sister (who’s not married), have the luxury of time. They have time to grieve. They have had more time to process my mom’s death than I have. Sometimes it feels like she died just a few months ago...it’s pretty raw at times. With the Holidays coming up…I’m dreading them honestly. Simply because I can’t think of the Holidays without her…I don’t want to think of the Holidays without her. I miss what our family was…I miss my mom.
Suzanne: …of course. Me too.
A pause
Suzanne: When it comes to grieving, it helps to label it. Call it what it is: “You’re grieving.” Be flexible with yourself. Be gracious with yourself. Let go of the time table. The grieving process, it really varies from person to person and you can’t compare. You have to have a moment of acceptance with yourself: This is where I am and it’s OK.
A pause…my daughter distracts us. We welcome the distraction. Children are a blessing from God in more ways than one.
Sarah: What do you want to say to the younger generation about friendship?
Suzanne: Start with…be to your friends a voice of acceptance and encouragement. Be people who can engage each other. Accept yourself for who you are and accept others for who they are…be free to be who you really are in your inner most part...
…Your mom, she saw more than skin deep. I think we all could learn a lot from that point of view.
